[STRATEGIA] Vast: The Crystal Cave

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[STRATEGIA] Vast: The Crystal Cave

Messaggioda vincyus » 27 feb 2018, 13:01

Allora, ho fatto varie partite a questo gioco (per adesso ho provato solo i ruoli Cavaliere, Caverna, Drago e Goblin).

Chiedevo consigli e strategie con i goblin. Non riesco a vincere con questo personaggio... mi ritrovo continuamente il cavaliere che riesce a fare velocemente molte sidequest e si potenzia molto la forza (tenendola sempre a 4). Purtroppo tra overpopulation, attacchi che mi procurano scatter e rage che mi si abbassa continuamente non riesco ad uccidere il knight. Rimane sempre sui 4-3 di vita. Consigli su come giocare i goblin? Forse sbagliamo qualcosa noi, ma è normale che il cavaliere riesca a completare tante sidequest velocemente? Thx
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Re: [STRATEGIA] Vast: The Crystal Cave

Messaggioda theclapofonehand » 27 feb 2018, 14:09

vincyus ha scritto:Allora, ho fatto varie partite a questo gioco (per adesso ho provato solo i ruoli Cavaliere, Caverna, Drago e Goblin).

Chiedevo consigli e strategie con i goblin. Non riesco a vincere con questo personaggio... mi ritrovo continuamente il cavaliere che riesce a fare velocemente molte sidequest e si potenzia molto la forza (tenendola sempre a 4). Purtroppo tra overpopulation, attacchi che mi procurano scatter e rage che mi si abbassa continuamente non riesco ad uccidere il knight. Rimane sempre sui 4-3 di vita. Consigli su come giocare i goblin? Forse sbagliamo qualcosa noi, ma è normale che il cavaliere riesca a completare tante sidequest velocemente? Thx

ti posto questo tread rubato a BGG dovrebbe risolvere i tuoi problemi:

Or “You got some Munchkin in my Vast.”
I hear some people being vocal about the difficulty of playing the Goblins compared to the other roles so I have agreed to write these notes about the Goblins.

Are we playing this right?
Remember if all three Tribes overpopulate you only have to remove one Tribe from the board and it doesn’t even have to be an over populated Tribe. So if you have 4, 4, 2 on the board and both 4s are going to hit this turn, by all means remove the weakest Tribe.

Early Strategy
Don’t worry about getting eaten early in the game. In fact I get concerned if at least 1 Tribe isn’t eaten early. It will set you up with more Rage for the mid-game. Having Rage early can help you steer into the better War cards. Also the Dragon is 4 long Sloth cubes from Armor 2. Armor 2 will keep the Dragon alive. You need to keep the Dragon alive to win.

War Cards - While the Goblins are off board you want to get the least number of Goblins possible. Once they are on board obviously you are trying not to go over 4. You will have to of course from time to time. Fear and Hate are powerful cards for this purpose.

Monsters - Strong Goblin players put their monsters in tribes where they are needed. If a Tribe is strong enough to hit the Knight that turn anyway (and will then scatter), there is no reason to assign them a monster as it will just be lost. Its tempting to put a +1 Strength monster in a Tribe but if they are going to hit anyway, it is just a waste of a monster. Stop it.

Ambush/Event - Try to keep the Fangs in hiding the first few turns to exploit Ambushes. Even if they don’t hit they slow the Knight down. If there are more Events in the early game that means there will be more Ambushes in the late game. Keep a tribe back. If you see more than 5 Ambushes in the Early game stop holding a tribe back.

If the Knight keeps moving 1 space a turn and places 4 Strength every turn, place all your Tribes and start cycling the Monster deck. It is going to be a long game but you can win it.

Exception - Nightmare Unicorn - The Knight won’t be exploring much so don’t worry about it ambushes.

Revealing - Keep your Tribes away from each other, no more than a Knight’s move away from each other. Putting them 2 spaces apart makes it easier for the Dragon to hit both.

Basically as the Goblins you are trying to create as many opportunities to hit the Knight as possible. To get those opportunities you need to keep Tribes on the board. That is all you should be focused on your first few games. Later on you will realize you can also slow the Cave down.

You should be focusing your efforts on Attacks, Special Actions, and Pillaging.

Attacks - Obviously this is how you win, so it should be your highest priority. Except in very weird scenarios at the end of the game if a Tribe can attack you should attack. Focus on the order of attack, attacking from the weakest to the most powerful Tribe. As you attack your Rage will get depleted and you don’t want the -1 Strength from Malaise costing you a hit.

Check every turn to make sure you can attack. Every revealed Tribe, every time.

If you can’t attack move towards the Knight using light to lose Goblins to keep your population trim. Even stop in the light and take a special action.

Special Actions - More cards, means more opportunity to find the right combo you need to hit. More Rage means less overpopulation (probably). Use a turn to walk towards the Knight and then beef up.

Plunder - Gives you Rage and hurts the Cave! I have had games where I have plundered twice to swing back to 3 Rage and take the initiative for the rest of the game.

Each Tribe has a special action they can use on turns they are not

Bones - The ability to draw Monsters is fantastic. Many of the Monsters can turn

Eyes - This power is of less utility than the others but has its moments. Being able to draw Secrets can help support the other Tribes getting hits. I have stationed them out at the end of a stack of Dark Tiles and just drawn secrets with them before.

I’ll be that guy and put +s after the Monsters I consider stronger than the others. I se

Blob (++) - The Blob is very important. Almost always give them to the Fangs to ensure delivery of the payload. The Dragon might target this tribe with prejudice, since a 5 grit loss at the right moment can spell disaster for the Knight. If you hit when the Knight is between 5 and 15 Grit that can be game over for the Knight right there.

Bright Beetles - So I have a confession to make. The Bright Beetles are just not that great. I feel a little designer guilt over them. In previous versions when each Goblin was tracked individually the Beetles were great, but now they are pretty meh. Keeping an extra Goblin might even be a hazard. I usually assign them to the Fangs so i can get them back faster after an attack.

I would entertain suggestions to replace them in the promotion cards.

Gnome - This guy can be a powerhouse at the right moment. He can allow a Tribe to plunder for a few turns as the Rage gained will help them stay on the board. A round of plundering in the mid-game can really trip up the Cave and refill your Rage meter. Being able to place anywhere can be handy in the early game when there are not many places to place or in the late game when the Cave is mostly explored.

Golem - The Golem is okay. You can create an opportunity to hit with the Golem when you otherwise can’t. The rest of the time it is a bit of a dud.

Ogre/Troll/Flame(+) Giant - You will need the extra strength in the end to win. Its that simple. You are looking for these monsters in the deck.

Pet Frog(+) - If I do need to put a Tribe off to the side so I can keep taking their special action over and over, the Pet Frog prevents me from worrying about their population. Then at the end of the game they can come out from the Dark Tile they are hiding from and get the final hit while ignoring Malaise.

Wisp(+) - Walking part way, pullin the Knight to you then attacking isn’t just the only use for the Wisp. 3 movement means the Knight will need to spend 2 Hero Tokens to get back into position to attack the Knight. That might prevent a hit. The best turns are the one where you lead the Knight into an alley you can hit her multiple times.

Underworm (+) - My favorite monster by a margin. Turns a weak chumpy tribe on the edge of the map into a powerhouse that will score you a hit at the end of the game. Remember here you can move, then move diagonally through walls and lit tiles and then continue moving to attack. I call hits with the Underworm stylish plus the name is awesome.

Of note here there are 3 cards that I call the hit cards. Blind Fury, Fire Bomber, and Hiding Spots. Poison can be a hit card too at the right moment. Rarely should you use more than 1 in an attack. It is almost always better to lay up for next turn and get multiple hits with multiple tribes.

Keeping a Tribe on the board an extra turn isn’t bad. It makes the Knight play more conservatively and you can use their Special Action.

Blind Fury(+) - I see this card misused all the time with new players. If you can get a hit without it, but would lose a Goblin in the light do not use the card. Once the tribe Scatters it will be 2 more War cards before they can attack again. Far better to have as low of population as you can get. Often times a better route will save this card.

Fire Bomber(+) - Simple enough. Try to avoid assigning a +1 Strength monster to the Tribe you are Firebombing with since you are probably going to overkill the Knight. Despite how awesome that sounds the Knight still only takes 1 wound at a time. I see this card overused frequently.

Cave-In (++) - Powerhouse of the Secrets deck. It pretty much cripples everyone else if used at the right moment. Wait for the mid-game and a full strength Eye Tribe and clean up a bunch of tiles in the middle of the board. Don’t cleave the board in two though and make sure all of the tiles you select board a lit tile on an open face. The Cave will have to replace the Tiles with dark tiles. Smart Cave players will use this as a chance to put a lot of walls near the Entrance to mess with the Dragon.

For you a lot of new Dark TIles in the center of the board open up a channel you can move through the center of the board. Now you can place much further from the Knight and still safely move to her on your turn. Also it will slow the Knight down as she has to burn up precious Encounters exploring the tiles. This allows the Dragon new opportunities to dodge the Knight and prolongs the game in your favor.

Goblin Ruby - It is okay. Obviously don’t play it on turns you are planning on emptying a Tribe. I usually use it to hedge against bad War cards and discard any monster that is not +1 Strength that I can’t see giving me an immediate chance to hit.

Hex (+1) - At the right moment this can make the Knight lose a Strength moments before an attack creating an opportunity to attack where there wasn’t one before. Feel free to hit the Cave with it too if the Cave is ahead.

Hiding Spots (+) - You can’t combine this with another card. I like to save it for when the Knight is at 3 Health and I start the turn with 2 Tribes revealed. If I can get the third hit with Hiding Spots win! Don’t forget to attack weakest to strongest.

Leader - I see this played incorrectly. Don’t use it on any turn you over populate. Use it on turns where overpopulation is going to cost you an opportunity to hit. If the Tribe you would lose due to overpopulation is too weak anyway no big deal. Save Leader.

Secret Tunnels - This card can be a little meh. You could plunder a Treasure or attack the Thief when you arrive in a pinch. It is handy against the upcoming Cave Ghost as a way to limit her Omen generation.

Poison (+) - The best time to use this is with a Tribe that is 2 or more Strength higher than the Knight while she has 4 cubes. Now she is missing 2 Cubes and has to work the hardest to get more. Obviously you want to wait to hit her until she is far from the Entrance.

Trap - There is no reason to not play this immediately. Don’t forget it is there. Don’t waste it protecting a Tribe from the Dragon that can’t hit on your next turn. The power on the card is optional when it comes to the Dragon.

Stupid Goblins Tricks
For each role (except the Knight) I have something I call a stupid ___ trick. Here are the devious plays for the Goblins.

Dragon Guards - A strong tribe can act as a pick for a weak Dragon as the Knight has to beat you to get through your space.

Exploring - You can reveal a strong Tribe to an open space. On the next turn if a Tribe explores the space under them they are free to move without penalty and attack. That is some PhD Goblin play right there.

Use a easily placed easy to get to Tribe as a bribe to keep the Dragon away from your other Tribes.

Above all else have fun wrecking the other player’s dreams and if you fail blame the machinations of a malevolent Cave.
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